The Practice Gap
The Practice Gap
#38 Embracing AI in Healthcare—Efficiency, Connection, and Innovation-Part 2 with Anders Kvarme
In this continuation of our AI episodes, we dive deeper into the transformative power of artificial intelligence with Anders Kvarme, an osteopath and dietician. Building on our previous discussion, Anders shares practical insights into how AI is revolutionizing healthcare by streamlining tasks, enhancing communication, and empowering practitioners to focus on what truly matters—patient care and meaningful connections.
Discover how Anders integrates AI into his practice to simplify complex processes, deliver faster responses, and stay ahead of professional knowledge. From crafting personalized patient advice to managing intricate dietary needs, he demonstrates how AI acts as the ultimate assistant for busy healthcare professionals.
This episode also explores how AI can lighten your workload, improve your work-life balance, and even spark creativity in everyday life. Whether you’re new to AI or looking to take your expertise to the next level, Anders offers actionable advice on making AI work for you.
Don’t miss this inspiring conversation about embracing technology to enhance both your practice and your personal life.
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Elisabeth Aas-Jakobsen, DC, MSc
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Hi and welcome to the Practice Gap, the podcast for closing the gap between the practice you have and the one that you want. I'm Elisabeth, a chiropractor, a business one. Yeah, hi, anders Kvarma, and welcome back to the studio. Thank you for having me again. Yeah, now we're going to have a little AI and artificial intelligence. 102.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we had a 101 in the last episode. Yeah, so if you're completely new to AI, please listen to the other episode first yes, that's super fundamental to listen to that, and if that was a bit overwhelming, hear it one more time and test it out before you hear this because this will overwhelm you even more. Anders is an osteopath and dietician. You can say both.
Speaker 1:He has a lot of gifts. He loves his work and AI makes his life easier because he can spend more time treating patients and less time doing boring stuff that he needs to get done yeah, and a happier wife before.
Speaker 2:When she called me after work, I said I'm just writing journals, I'm finished in 10 minutes. I always said 10 minutes and one and a half hour later I just yeah, okay, I'm in the car now. I'm in the car now, okay, so that, and I don't miss that era that's in reach. We are in an age where this is actually doable, where everyone can just be finished, like you said, 10 minutes after they're done. You're done, you've done everything.
Speaker 1:Let's make that next year's goal to be done when you're done.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but actually that is a super goal. Actually I'm a bit fan of setting goals and plan to make the goals, so that could be an advice. In January you get an expert in just clean up your journal notes, that's it. And the next month you take another one, another, one, another one.
Speaker 1:Okay, so this episode we are going to paint the future you are going into if you learn how to use ai I.
Speaker 2:I am a kind of therapist that likes to be available. So every new patient in my office with a few exceptions, almost everyone get my phone number so they can reach me. I always tell that I'm. You know that when Almost everyone get my phone number so they can reach me, I always tell them. You know that when you give out your phone number and your mail then many of them will not use it, but they know you are available. So maybe once a year you just get a text with an easy question.
Speaker 2:I don't get a lot of mails and texts from patients, so it's not a super burden on me. But when I just get a mail, that one time they need an answer from me, it's actually very important for them to get a proper answer. Yesterday this happened. Yesterday I had a patient mailing me. She had what she thought was a trigger point in the top of the sternocleidomastoid is, but it wasn't painful when she touched it. So then I was like I'm always in a hurry and I just told text expander, ask her to go to the dentist if she doesn't feel sick and just explain that this could be a lymph node or something like that. And then it just explained that like good, but I thought it was a bit technical. So I was like this is a non-professional, explain simpler and a bit longer. And then I was done.
Speaker 2:So then I had this long yeah, the and when you are a beginner, just do this explain. Answer this male in a positive tone, tell her that the prolapse is not dangerous and explain this. Yeah, as for a non-professional, keep it as simple as that. Maybe next year in May you are a super advanced user of Chachipt. You can. When you get the answer, I always paste it into Outlook and I add a few sentences myself and correct a little bit here and there. I find that sometimes quicker than just make them Chachipiti rephrasing it. But when you have written that mail, perfectly tailored as you want it, you paste it back to Chachipiti to feed it with your information and your way of writing and then it will remember it.
Speaker 1:When you say feed it into. How do you do that?
Speaker 2:Most of the time. I just I wanted this mail to be like this remember how I explained this to the next time I need it. Yeah, so it has this function now that it remembers a lot of things you have talked about with it before, so there are several ways of feeding it actually, but that's the sort of the next level from the very easy way of doing it so let's just sum up this one, okay.
Speaker 1:So if I have, you can use it to communicate fast with your patients. Who either sends an email or worried about something, yeah, or sends an SMS, yeah. And to all of those, I know there are some colleagues of mine who are super hesitant to give their phone numbers out or the mail yeah and I'm very happy that you have the same same feelings as me there yeah it's very, very seldom that they use it yeah, it's almost, and they always start.
Speaker 1:I'm so sorry for contact you. Yeah, and sometimes at least, when I get an sms from a new patient saying, oh, my friend told me to contact you, could you like do you have a time for me? Which that is a good that's a great thing to actually say, but it's a wonderful service.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah. And when I give away my number I make it as a joke and I always say I'm a world champion in not working when I'm not working. So if you text me in the evening, sometimes I answer. Sometimes you will receive the answer next day. I don't have a sort of response time guarantee with it, and they are fine with that. Of course they understand that. But then I've just set the context and the tone for the way to use my private number. So I've done this for now 12 years. I've never had a negative experience with it.
Speaker 1:I must say when other professionals I have my mother's doctor's number and once in a while I use it maybe every second year or something and he responds like this because he knows there's a crisis if I ever give him an SMS and I think it's the best service I've ever had in my whole life. I think he's amazing just because he does this, and I would never, ever, ever use it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you feel closer to the therapist. I feel so close.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and he's not even my doctor, so it's just an amazing thing to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And we are all about giving our patients the best service ever.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, thing to do, yeah, and we all.
Speaker 1:We are all about giving our patients the best service ever yes, yes, okay I fell out a little bit. Now we're back into, we're going from the emotional things about having being a good practitioner and this.
Speaker 2:Let me explain pre pre chachipati, if I have done this for 12 year giving up my number, so before there was periods I didn't have so much time to write when I didn't have a full practice. You have that 20 minutes to write this perfect answer and that quality just fades off as the more busy you get. But now I can go back to the old days. I can always give a quality answer back and it looks like it's written for me and I am the editor of this. So in my opinion I totally stand behind that. It's my. I just get help. It's like I have a secretary.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it's having an assistant, so we shouldn't take a thing, because I know that a lot of people think that, oh, now somebody else is doing anyone can do this. Now somebody else is doing my job. But that's not right, is it? No, no. Paralegal or a secretary and you're just like okay, I need you to write this letter to Elizabeth. Talk about this and this and this is what I find, and she just goes and types it, or he goes and types it and sends it out and I go to my next client.
Speaker 2:so it's that's a that's an excellent example in other other professionals, professions in other professions these are.
Speaker 2:This is a common thing, but because we are not, we don't get a millionaire from being a therapist, so we don't afford to having a secretary. But now you have it twenty dollars a month, you have the premium. There is a possible to have a free account as well. That would perfectly work in the beginning. But you know, 20 for this if you save a half an hour a day. For me, chachipity is a hybrid with my brain now, so it's unbelievable how much you can get out of it if you.
Speaker 1:Yeah get a little better each month.
Speaker 2:Don't think, think that you will be an expert in January, but in 2027.
Speaker 2:So another area we haven't discussed is that this is a large language model, as I explained, so it's fed with a lot of text.
Speaker 2:That means that ChatGPT is able to read huge amounts of text in just seconds. So, for example, a few weeks ago I had an Osgood-Schlatter patient, a young boy, and knee is not the area I have on top of mind all the time, of course, I know it, but we all have this, some areas you are super tight with and other, and I was a bit insecure about which advices to give, and actually I told the mother that I think this is Osgood's letters. I need to check this, I need to talk to a colleague and blah blah. And after I discussed it with Chachi Petit, I went to a colleague, which is very good with niece, but when I used Chachi Petit, my questions was more specific. So I also make the communication with my colleagues better too, because I can say, like okay, I feel that he needs to deload this and that and do this exercise. What is your opinion? And then he can give me his expert opinion in that question and then you save time there too yes, yes, and it sort of everyone gets better.
Speaker 1:It's a win-win-win.
Speaker 2:It's a win-win Actually. So what I did there is I, at the first consultation, I did this long draft, as I always do. I cleaned it with ChatGPT, typed it in to the journal and wrote the journal finished and then I went back to ChatGPT because it's a chat. I went on PubMed, I found an article on Oscud statters and I went to Olympiatoppen, found the article there and I took that into ChatGPT and I said okay, read these articles and write me a summary which is relevant to this case. How long time does that take if you do this manually?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it takes forever forever, it's something you were like oh, I would love to have time to do that.
Speaker 2:That's not gonna happen yes, you know, when you are a nerd and you love your work, you it's a bit of a grief, in a way, when you get busy and you feel that shit, I I should have read about this, but I don't find the time and the space to do it. So you just start to feel, okay, I'm getting old, I'm getting busy, this, and that I was eager before, so then I had four hours a day. But now I can do this again Because almost every article out there you can summarize. Like, if you read 12% or something in an article, you have the main sense of it and ChatGPT can do this for you. So it can summarize and it can also relate to the actual case you have.
Speaker 2:Let me give a nerdy example. It sounds advanced but it isn't so. Like back to the assistant analogy we talked about a few minutes ago, imagine you you are having a professionally trained assistant which is a super fast typer. They can look things up. They can, they can do everything you want, but they are not a chiropractor. You need to to to describe to them how to do it and what to cite and what not to cite. So that's sort of the the underlying principle you should have in your mind when you think about how to tailor made made this to your, how to tailor this to your actual needs.
Speaker 2:So, for example, as a dietician, I have a few areas of expertise there as well, and one of this is IBS patient irritable bowel syndrome and that is a quite of a tricky condition because there are so many dietary triggers that can trigger different symptoms and the symptoms can be different. Every patient is different, and some patients they are sensitive to sugar alcohols and someone is to fructans and someone are sensitive to overdose of protein. There is so many variables here. So and I am I like to when people come to me that I am the expert, I never give out just one recipe like just follow this low food map diet here, good luck, see you in three months, and they will cancel the consultation because that's rubbish, I think. So I have made a diary. It's made in excel. It's super easy. They write what they eat breakfast, lunch, snack, after training, dinner, everything and they have a section when they comment and they also have a score.
Speaker 2:And when I analyze this, I open the Excel sheet and I just reading, getting an overview first and see is there sugar alcohols there? When they are at the worst. Or is it fructanes, is it galactanes, is it sorbitol? And I sort of make some hypothesis and ask them okay, can you we start just with removing the sugar alcohols and see what happens? And I see them in a few weeks and and so we test out each thing. So then the the advices I give becomes bearable, because if I ask someone to remove a ton of food it's not doable, it doesn't work. But if you give them maybe five to seven things to avoid and in my experience, if I'm doing the analysis thoroughly, maybe four out of five gets way better after the first consultation. So that's a bit of a speciality I have.
Speaker 2:But this makes me it takes a while for me to actually do this and this complicated list. I cannot remember this in my mind. I've worked with this for many years but I cannot remember it like there could be three different molecules in one in onion, for example. So what I have done is I have this description we talked about earlier. I have made this actually quite complicated. I'm telling I am a dietician and I'm receiving an irritable bowel syndrome patient up front. They have for two weeks logged what they eat in a diary and I'm now going to analyze this diary. When I type in one word like onion, only answer me if it's low food map, moderate food map, high food map, and then you tell me which molecules it is and that's it. So then I have actually programmed it to do exactly what I need. So when I am sitting there with my Excel sheet and I type without looking, so I don't look at ChatGPT, I just type in different foods In the description.
Speaker 2:I have also said do this until I say analyze. And when I typed in analyze, it sort of clogs together all the. It sort of clogs together the different foods, that's under sorbitol, for example. And then I quickly see, okay, sorbitol has 10 different foods and fructans 2 and lactose has 3. Okay, I go for the sorbitol. And then I say, okay, make a journal note of this. And then I also have a in the description.
Speaker 2:Then I have said when I write journal, just just the word journal, that's it. And then I have this description of how to write the journal. So I have upfront analyzed this and this and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah everything in detail how I want it and summarize the findings. This was the findings and we are going to focus about sorbitol, because that's the most significant find, significant find in the analysis. So then my patient comes in, we talk a little bit about this and this and which, which type of food they should avoid and what they should replace it with, and blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 2:I write some notes during that consultation as well. Then I go back to chat GPT when they leave and I. Then I go back to ChatGPT when they have left, I paste in the draft and then they have the analysis upfront and if I have had some questions during the analysis, all this is included in the chat. So then they can finish the journal for me and I can write a summary to my patient so they get it directly after. They don't have to wait two days as they did before because I was too busy. And then the referral therapist also can have a summarization of this like written in a more professional way. So this is also included in my very, very long description. And here is the beauty of having text expander instead of Word, because then I just type in like I think it's GPT Analyzation or something, and then it types this huge, long description and actually it's like having a software that you have.
Speaker 1:For those who don't necessarily are into the different diets. But how can you use it for exercise? So if I have a patient who is osteoporotic, she's 70 years old and she hates exercise and her back pain, she has back pain. Can I put that into creativity and give a list of suggestions she can do?
Speaker 2:Yes. So when you have this certain area of expertise, sit down and just think through what are the patient's journey from booking the first session until the 10th treatment. What are the journey? What do I give them? What do I feed them? There is always a few exercises you give more often, but if they are too old you maybe don't give things that make the risk higher for them falling during the exercise. Then you replace it. So you have all this if this, if that so, start off by writing a description.
Speaker 1:So if I take all the. I mean we usually give there, I mean we give many advice, but some are our favorites. That's yes, yes. So if I write, if I feed that into it like my favorite exercises, and then I can say, okay, she's a pregnant woman this and this age, sitting too much in the office or hates exercising or something and then I can give the regular advice I would give that kind of person and then I feed it in different kind of persons and then I can use all that information in a very easy way to tailor something for this new patient.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, so.
Speaker 2:So again here if you have a certain thing you need to tailor Chachipati to help you with, don't think that, okay, I need to develop this and have a full day at work doing this. Take one lunch and just take what's on top of your mind and then think that, okay, for each time I'm having an osteoporotic patient, I will allow myself to use five minutes updating the description. When you have done that for three months, you never need to do it and, to be realistic, you will not.
Speaker 2:You, you have still to use some time on doing it, just to not talk this into the skies. This is not meant to replace your brain. You are still the. You know. The most common misconception I hear is that ah, yeah, it's that thing. Yeah, okay, you are AI user, so you don't need to think anymore to learn anymore. This will just replace you in total. But I find it quite the opposite, because now I have never been so updated on the things I care about. I've never read so many professional articles. You can actually also paste in a YouTube video. It will read the transcription of the video and summarize it for you. So I've I've never been able to be more updated and I am seeing more patient, and I spent less time on this.
Speaker 2:I've actually freed up so much time that I actually have a start-up at the side of my professional practice and I have two kids, so this has made me be able to do more of the things I want in life and still come home and see my family in normal time so it actually makes, it makes a better person.
Speaker 1:Yes, definitely.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, we can, we can like that and, to be honest, I was a bit nervous coming here today talking English. I'm not a native English and I'm not using English every day. So on the way here I connected ChatGPD to my car, the intercom in my car. I can also talk to it. So that's a bit. Yeah, that also scares me sometimes. To be honest, even me gets scared of this. But I and I just said I'm going to Elisabeth, I'm a guest at her podcast. We are going to talk about how I use ai in my professional practice. Can you please be the host and I can practice on you? So then I got 45 minutes of practice. So all of the mumbling and stumbling and oh shit, what was that word? Again, I could just ask it and it will, and that so and takes the anxiety level down.
Speaker 1:And then you come in here and you're not stressed anymore. Yes yeah, so you can actually use it if you are. Oh, I found a good way Because we are especially in the beginning of your career. It's all the difficult questions you know, so then you could feel difficult questions into it and get better answers.
Speaker 2:Yes, definitely feel difficult to pay questions into it and get better answers. Yes, definitely yeah. If you are directly from school, there are so many things you are insecure about you don't know yet how much you know. The first two years is just about discovering. Just okay, I'm not as bad as I think I. I know quite a lot actually. So then, to have a sparring partner they will never judge, yeah, and if you have a mentor or colleagues you learn from, you can ask more intelligent questions.
Speaker 2:You don't come like fresh feeling like and you be asking shit you should know so you can just, you know, take the little burden of it before you ask, as I did today in the car, just snuggling and bumbling a little bit with myself before I came to you.
Speaker 1:I must say Anders was talking. We had a nice discussion yesterday before our podcast and I was super motivated and I used it this morning. Since I'm traveling, I said I'm going to Washington DC this time of year, could you? I want to pack very little. What should I?
Speaker 2:pack. Yeah, how to pack, to blend in as a magna fan, and it was and then also a woman.
Speaker 1:It was so much fun when it came out four shirts, two pants and I thought about it. It's like completely right, and you always pack too much, and it was really I mean, I know how to pack, but it was a fun thing to do. Yeah, so you can use it for all these. Uh, it's actually quite fun and it makes you think a little bit.
Speaker 2:yeah, like I hear. A few weeks ago, I, I'm like I. My goal is to always shop as much food as possible, so I have for the entire week, but sometimes I fail to communicate with my wife about this. And then we both bought this paprika package with three paprikas, so we ended up having eight peppers.
Speaker 1:Red peppers, peppers, yes, red peppers, okay.
Speaker 2:So she had also bought this three pack with pepper. We had actually eight peppers, so I just what to use. How do I? So I asked Chachipiti okay, I'm a bit tired of the Nordic foods. I have eaten a lot of Asian foods. Do you have something from the Middle East or Africa? And then it suggested a dish called shakshuka.
Speaker 1:I've never made it, tasted it before I been actually made that yeah yeah, yeah, I've never seen it before.
Speaker 2:So then I just uh from the things I had. I also then told chachi petit that I have eggs, I have this, I have that, and it suggested recipes out of their, the ingredients I had one of my colleagues.
Speaker 1:She said yesterday she used chachi petit to say I have this in the fridge and I think she is it right that you can take a picture of it.
Speaker 2:No, maybe she should. That could be. I haven't tried that before.
Speaker 1:And she said she had used it. I think she actually took a picture of the fridge. What should I make? And they made some recipes.
Speaker 2:That's very cool, that's cool.
Speaker 1:That's super cool. All right, we are falling off on limb. What we can sum up is it's super exciting and we shouldn't be scared. We should enjoy it and we should find ways to make I a part of your life make our life easier so we can spend more time being together as people and with the people. We love to free up time to do things that matter. Yes, yes perfect. Yeah, thank you so much, anders, I know I'm gonna invite you back this was nice being here.
Speaker 2:Yes, perfect, thank you, thank you.